Can one truly change sexual orientation…to pray oneself straight…or is it just a delusion…?

Oh, rb, this is such an easy one. (As you would say) Erm… Fuck No!! and Fuck No!! and Fuck Yes!! Answering all three questions separately, of course. See how simple? End of line…

P.S. Oh, goody! Another homosexual thread! Could be fun!?

Well, hell…this could be an interesting one.

So…to answer the question, we’d have to have some kind of answer as to what determines a gay sexual orientation, yes? Genetics. Neural wiring. Society. I have no freaking clue, and I’ve never really discussed it with gay buddies.

Koo, care to speak for “your people?” : D

Well, of course, my dear, just waiting for some more comment, but we already crossed comments above, too. I’ll get to work on a little rant. It won’t necessarily be nice to “my people”, though. As with all humans, most everyone is so damned ignorant. There aren’t many like us, that’s why I have been so glad to meet each and every one of you. You make me feel that there is some hope for humankind, after all. I’ll be back atcha, sugar, bet on it!

Going thru the public school experience…I’ve known chaps who were gay(VERY discreetly)...some were vey cool,nice folk…some were total,evil creeps…not unlike the general population…

I’ve had a couple of friends who had homosexual tendencies; I don’t know how all those went, and I don’t know of that’s the situation of “bisexuality,” but one struggled alot, and two others chose heterosexuality. Satolkin, I think you’re right about origins being a big part of the equation, and as far as I know, there are many potential sources. It will be interesting to hear what you have to say, Koo.

So, some of you are aware of my current situation in which my wife left because “she wasn’t happy” and is now living at our house in a different town with her “girlfriend”... she expressed to me before we got married that she had previously engaged in some homosexual encounters and considered herself bisexual… you say someone can’t truly change their sexual orientation… therefore I have no reason to worry that I have driven my wife to lesbianism??? Which of course is probably one of the worst blows to the male ego and I only really bring it up for its humor value…

edit: She does, by the way, consider herself a Christian so if she does turn lesbian than the answer to RB’s post would be: Fuck yes, erm…yes to the opposite, and fuck no…

ratboy wrote:
Can one truly change sexual orientation…to pray oneself straight…or is it just a delusion…?

Question is, why would one want to? Sexual orientation, whether genetic or otherwise, does NOT interfere with one’s ability to participate in society. Therefore, psychologically speaking, there’s no reason to change.

That’s why the APA no longer classifies homosexuality as mental illness. There’s no reason to consider it as such.

Yes, Aran, orgies are a big part of the equation, wait, errrr, I mean origins (lol). I’m trying to figure out a response that takes all of our concerns into account. I’m aworkin’ on it, to paraphrase Mae West.

SwissCelt wrote:
>Sexual orientation, whether genetic or otherwise, does NOT interfere with one’s ability to participate in society. Therefore, psychologically speaking, there’s no reason to change.

I think necrophilia interferes with your ability to participate in society…

Necrophilia… I’m sad to say that I know what that word means…

AL, I wouldn’t call that a sexual orientation, just as I wouldn’t call paedophilia a sexual orientation. For one thing, there’s the matter of consent…

absoluteliquid wrote:
> Which of course is probably one of the worst blows to the male ego

Nah. Just say you ruined her for other men.

and I only really bring it up for its humor value…

Go with that, and laugh your ass off. Preferably with a new girlfriend that will become a new wife. Hard to picture now, I know, but…shop around. Pick a good one. Grow old and die together. Life is weird and shit happens.

Satolkin wrote:
Life is weird and shit happens.

I’ve ALWAYS said that…

SwissCelt wrote:
>AL, I wouldn’t call that a sexual orientation, just as I wouldn’t call paedophilia a sexual orientation. For one thing, there’s the matter of consent…

I wouldn’t either… I was being facetious…

absoluteliquid wrote:
>> <i>SwissCelt wrote:</i>
>>Sexual orientation, whether genetic or otherwise, does NOT interfere with one’s ability to participate in society. Therefore, psychologically speaking, there’s no reason to change.

I think necrophilia interferes with your ability to participate in society…

Necrophilia…also an issue of consent…baring the dear departed date’s ghost saying it’s a jolly fine plan…

It isnt wasy thats fersure. I think that its kinda like the whole pill tetsing thing when their about to prove the effectiveness of a pill.They give half the people the pill and the other half sugar pills without teling them. Some of the people who have taken the sugar pill say they feel better, but that’s only because they THOUGHT they were taking the perscription. It’s all in yuor head…If you believe prayer will help you change and you have that desire in you, it might just work :)))

Very surprising attitude for a religious person…

LdsGal202 wrote:
It’s all in your head…

I had to keep telling myself that during my time on some hallucinogens…

The giant spiders were REAL…

Thankfully never any spiders… but there were definitely some FAR out there times when I had no grasp whatsoever on this reality thingy…life or whatever you want to call it… like floating in inner space with infinity around your mind and not a rational thought in sight… prayer was the only thing I had that kept me sane (somewhat)... I certainly had my perceptions realigned…

not done the old LSD thing amounst my sins…yet…the old Pa was one total hippie back in the day…He won’t say what he injested…but I’ve heard tales…

I’ll say, here’s a list:

lol

ratboy wrote:>Can one truly change sexual orientation…to pray oneself straight…or is it just a delusion…?

I was being flip with my first reaction above. This is a very difficult subject. There are straight people, bisexuals, and homosexuals and all points in-between. This is gonna be hard to explain…

I don’t know where the orientation comes into play. I think I was born with it. I NEVER had an interest in girls sexually. I knew the mechanics of it, and I did mess around with women, but knew that I wasn’t interested (except for an orgasm). But some other people are different. Some people have no idea they’re gay, it never entered their mind, then boom, a homosexual experience, and they’re gay! or bisexual, or who the hell knows?? Someone with a straight orientation may turn bisexual (my boyfriend is an example) and maybe not forever. A bisexual may have a satisfying straight relationship, so never (or rarely) acts upon homosexual urges. But for the sake of this topic, i will concentrate on straight or gay orientation, ‘twill be a lot simpler.

Be aware that I am telling you what I think about this. I may not be right, I only know how I feel about it. I do have a lot of experience in this area, though, so I do feel LIKE an expert. (lol)

I don’t think you can change your sexual orientation. I think you will always prefer one sex over the other. However, if you don’t like your sexual orientation, you don’t have to act upon it. Many gay men are happily married to a woman. They may have never acted upon it, but they probably know it’s there. They don’t want to act upon it. A man can “perform” equally with a woman or a man. And, of course, a gay man can father children. This is another reason gay men marry, they love children, too. They’d like to have a family and that is more important to them than which sex they sleep with. They love their wives as much as any hetero male and their wives love them. And their wives may know about the man’s sexual orientation, too. There are very few secrets in a marriage. Who knows, too, there could be a divorce and he goes completely gay. There are so many degrees here and so many possibilities, too.

So, the ex-gay thing… I don’t think the ex-gay thing works as far as actually changing one’s orientation. There are thousands of religious gay men who don’t want to be gay (mostly due to their religion). These ex-gay “ministries” are presented to them and they jump aboard hoping they can change. Their orientation doesn’t change, but they will learn how not to act upon their urges. So, they learn to change their BEHAVIOR. If they really want to be straight, it takes willpower and then it will look that way to nearly everyone, including themselves. That’s usually good enough for them, too. It doesn’t work for some people, and they remain actively gay or go back to that behavior. I am not saying that I approve of this crap, because that’s what it is. I think people should act the way they want and damn the consequences, but that’s just me (grin). Many former counselors and leaders of ex-gay ministries say that they don’t REALLY work. I know people who have gone through this. Some of you probably don’t realize how much pain this can cause a person. I mean, you’re gay. You don’t wanna be gay because you are deeply religious and you think it is wrong. Your family and friends think it’s wrong, too. You try to change. You do all kinds of things that you think will help you change. It doesn’t work, and you realize that it won’t work. Talk about a festering psychosis!! But most people deal with it just fine by doing as above because they are practical and relatively sane. It does drive some people nuts, but there’s nothing you or I can do about it, it’s their problem. Additional counseling can help, but I say let the professionals do it. I’ve got my own sanity to worry about. So, it does not appear that you can pray yourself straight, at least from my perspective. You all may feel differently.

Basically, I answered the delusion question above. I will add that it seems a delusion, but some people are satisfied with that and it works for them! Some are not satisfied, which may make their lives more troubled.

Thanks, rb, for a very cool topic. Any questions, just holler at your Auntie Koo!

Satolkin wrote:>Well, hell…this could be an interesting one. So…to answer the question, we’d have to have some kind of answer as to what determines a gay sexual orientation, yes? Genetics. Neural wiring. Society. I have no freaking clue, and I’ve never really discussed it with gay buddies. Koo, care to speak for “your people?” : D

I don’t know, Satol, genetics? I rarely discuss these things with any of my buddies either. Some folks don’t know they’re gay (or bi) until they have an experience and they go “wow, didn’t know I really wanted this all along”. Their orientation was inhibited, I guess. (?) I think that society does imprint that gayness is not “really” normal, even in these times. Look at my above post and if you have additional questions, I may be able to answer them. I don’t have as much clue as you may think, though.