Though I had no hand(or paw) in the sordid business…I’ve alles felt somewhat embarrarred that the former Communist states,officially atheistic,would abuse and mistreat any who clung to their beliefs…This is just WRONG…No person of non-faith should have the temerity to force their lack of belief on others…

Agreed. Gives Rat a high four PLUR to ye, my fellow furry one.

“You like me…you really like me”...sniff…nay…that was Ms. S. Field…but thanky for the jolly high thingy thar FiNiX…

High thingy? Have you never heard of a high five? (Rats and foxes have four fingers on each paw, just so you know.)

counts digits on paw…”dammit…he’s correct again”...

Yurp. Four fingers and a dew claw which sprouts pointlessly from the wrist. (well, foxes have one anyway. I don’t know whether rats have dew claws or not. I forget.)

I really shouldn’t be discussing me personals here in public like…

We’re currently on the subject of toes, Rat. Nowhere near the personals.

Oh, please do discuss, I so want to know all these details.

You’re right, communist states were not nice to the religious. But you notice how many of them no longer exist. It didn’t work, did it? But why are you apologizing for them? I knew you had something to do with it, rb, when I find out what it was, you’re in deep trouble. However, since those states are newly religious, RBism could use a few converts, especially well heeled converts…

Bring back stalin.

I keed!! I love you guys.

Hell, bring him back, maybe someone here can convert him!

St. Stalin…I can see it now…

I don’t think you should use the word communist tho. While that is what they called themselves, they didn’t practice true communism. Stalinism was pretty much a brutal dictatorship and Mao was no better. Castro ( as far as I know) never persecuted christians but they’re not really straight up commies either.

Communism means what it has been historically embodied and represented to mean in common modern parlance. An ideology that is supposedly possible to practice, but which has led to such disaster time and time again, with no show of success and such consistent and extreme economic and humanitarian depravity, cannot be adequately defended by just saying that it has never been tried in its true form.

Please…lets STOP trying…

I always found the atheism part to be interesting.

Arandur wrote:
>Communism means what it has been historically embodied and represented to mean in common modern parlance. An ideology that is supposedly possible to practice, but which has led to such disaster time and time again, with no show of success and such consistent and extreme economic and humanitarian depravity, cannot be adequately defended by just saying that it has never been tried in its true form.

I’m not defending it. I’m just stating that it’s never been done correctly. I’m a very mild tempered capitalist myself.

That’s a very good description, ec, i feel that way myself.

i’m a monarchist me…queens do it better

It may never have been done correctly, EC, but since every attempt has been so terrible, I think that points pretty solidly to some serious fundamental flaws in the idea that should lead us to just bury communism deeply and forget about it altogether. I remember how romanticized it was during college, the self-delusion and waste of time that went on from flirting with those ideas that are really useless except as a description of what not to try. Better to just try to make capitalism work better.

emptycalm wrote:
>Castro ( as far as I know) never persecuted christians but they’re not really straight up commies either.

Castro destroyed the (Catholic) Church in Cuba. Most clergy fled after the overthrow of Batista. Those who didn’t were, in fact, persecuted in the wake of the failed Bay of Pigs Invasion (the first war America ever lost, though historians are reluctant to admit this). Since 1992, relations with the Church have improved, although the Church can only accept revenue from the government.

(random thought:) Swiss, that reminds me of an anti-Catholic pamphlet I saw distributed around among some non-LDS sectarian believers in the Book of Mormon…it claimed that the Catholic Church was the Great Abominable Church, and one of its “evidences” was that Castro was supposedly a minion of the Church (it was part of their Jesuit conspiracy theories; they claimed Castro was a Jesuit). Maybe I should forward the thing on to Pig, JT, and other conspiracy theorists here; they might like it :)

Well, yes, rb, hands down, Empresses, too! (No, there is only ONE, no plurals, now edit that out, i command it! Well, it would look kinda stoopid as just “Empress”, so never mind!) Switch one letter and you’d be a monachrist! (whatever that is)

I agree, bury it or throw it out with the trash. Marxist dictatorships are really all we’ve seen, not representative of the communist “ideal”. I also say, fuck communism!

My Grandma Henry was Weslayan, super fundamentalist Weslayan. They demonized the catholic church, especially the pope. It wasn’t in their services or prayer meetings, just sometimes a topic of discussion at those and other various church functions.

Those Jesuits are clever!

Yes, Koo, they’re really more clever and powerful than the Illuminati…JT should be worried…

Arandur wrote:
>Yes, Koo, they’re really more clever and powerful than the Illuminati…JT should be worried…
And they(Jesuits) can really throw a punch…as my father can attest…