I’m new to this site, just got an account today. But I’ve been reading the site for a couple of months. I just never gave myself enough time to join in the conversation. I have a question. I’m a youth pastor in a church. I have noticed that there is a big disconnect between how Christians see themselves and how everybody else sees them. Some of the people I trust the least are people that I have gone to church with…which is a super sad thing. I see Christians being judgmental, hypocritical, anti-homosexual, and many other things. But when I read the Bible, those things are opposites of how we are to live. If we want to have a positive impact on people, what should we do. Not even to get more people to convert to Christianity, but to just help make the world better. I would love to hear from Christians, and definitely people who believe differently. (Also, if this topic has already been talked about, let me know, and I’ll go read on that topic)

Hi dex! Welcome to the GLSU website! This is definitely a new topic, my friend. In fact, I can already see branches sprouting from it to form more new topics. Well, OK, I have a vivid imagination or perhaps a flashback lol. If you’ve been perusing the site, you probably already know a little about some of us. Be sure to go to the Introduce Yourself thread and do that. That’s always fun and you can make all kinds of strange remarks there like we do.

So, what should we do? Well, I’m gonna sleep on it if that’s OK with you for now… Up all night surfing the net and didn’t get here till bedtime. I’ll get back to you this evening or ASAP. Good Morning…

Welcome on board dex… I agree with your statement about the difference between self perception and how the rest of the world views Christians. I believe this is a direct result of a lack of accountability in the church. And the lack of Christians in general to read the Bible and and live by it’s standards of love and direction. In example there is no correction when a so called Christian is blasting a “deviant lifestyle”... and the selective focus of the other side to over hype such occurrences… the accepting and loving element don’t cause as much of a ripple and are sort of overlooked… I believe that the church exists in the hearts of true followers of Christ and that is what I strive for. It is a daily struggle but I try to judge only myself and better my walk with the Lord from it… Who knows though… maybe I am a condescending judgemental hypocrite and don’t even realize it… I would hope someone would have called me on it by now… Again… welcome and good start of a new thread…

PLUR
IMHO

A newcomer! Welcome!

Live lives of virtue. Be a Saint. Harder to do than to say, but worthy of striving for. There really is no other solution than love.

If you’re looking for specific strategies to achieve specific goals, what goals in particular?

My only goal is really to learn, and maybe see something from a different perspective. Sometimes, I can get so caught up in what I’m doing, and think everything that I’m doing is so “right.” I feel part of my responsibility is to help people make an impact on the world to be a better place, whether it’s here in my city, or helping people in other countries. Obviously, Christians are not doing a good job of that, and that is why there is this disconnect.
I was reading an article a few weeks ago about a term, “christianaphobia”—the fear of Christians. Because it does seem that Christians can be against a lot and can almost be violent towards people who see things differently, calling them pagans, or lost, or without God, or whatever. I know that’s not what we are to be about, and I want to see if I am overlooking something, or if I could be doing something, unknowingly, that could be helping to cause this negative perception.

Anyways, it’s just something that I have been thinking about for a while, and I just want a little feedback.

One reason I think is because they seem to see things in pretty black and white terms such as you are going to burn in hell or you’re not. It seems like those who feel they are “in the know” have a superiority complex. I have been talking with christians about their belief or whatever and have them say “oh well I guess we will see when yr burning in hell” as part of a serious discussion because they didn’t know what else to say! As someone who is on the other side looking at christianity, i can say that how you perceive yr faith is a lot more accurate to what jesus preached about than most people. It does say in the bible the road to heaven in narrow right? Don’t worry man. Most people are stupid anyway and wont understand that you’re trying to be a good person in accordance with yr religion.

emptycalm wrote:
>One reason I think is because they seem to see things in pretty black and white terms such as you are going to burn in hell or you’re not.

“They?”
EC, stop. One of the things Dex is talking about is a disconnect. It doesn’t just come from “us” Christians, there are assumptions made on the “other” side about Christians that “they” have gotten from a minority of us.

Yes, a minority. What I particularly like about Dex’s posts is that he really does sound like the majority. We’re not bad guys, despite what the likes of Falwell and Robertson would have you believe.

Satolkin wrote:
>> <i>emptycalm wrote:</i>
>>One reason I think is because they seem to see things in pretty black and white terms such as you are going to burn in hell or you’re not.

“They?”
>EC, stop. One of the things Dex is talking about is a disconnect. It doesn’t just come from “us” Christians, there are assumptions made on the “other” side about Christians that “they” have gotten from a minority of us.

Yes, a minority. What I particularly like about Dex’s posts is that he really does sound like the majority. We’re not bad guys, despite what the likes of Falwell and Robertson would have you believe.

Then why do people like falwell and rush limbaugh or that other piece of shit ted haggart have so many followers and why do right voting christians vote in the most corrupt and inept leaders in the entire country? I’m sorry for getting the wrong impression of how christians think but what else am I supposed to go on? Everything I see everywhere is just negative. You are delusional if you think it’s just a small minority

Do you ever actually try to broaden your perspective or practice the much-vaunted quality of “tolerance” when it comes to Christians, EC? Because it really doesn’t sound like you even wander out of your anti-Christian comfort zone to look for some reality.

One of the problems with the “bad” christian minority is that they talk the loudest. And they ARE bad, despicably evil, too, in some cases. I respected my pastor so much in my youth. I KNOW that he would say that Falwell sins when he goes off on all those people. (Yeah, I know he’s dead, and good riddance, I say! There are always some people who should have died long before they did. He’s one of them, king of the haters in hell now, I guess, if there was such a place…) I may not be religious, but I know evil when I see it. Tolerance doesn’t have a damn thing to do with it, either. Evil is evil and should not be tolerated by anyone! But I have yet to see ONE religious person tell it like it is about him, Robertson or any of that ilk. If you christians would stand up and expel those assholes from your religion, we’d have a lot more respect for you and perhaps THEN, some tolerance would be applicable. (Pat Robertson: “Whatever calamity just befell mankind, it is God’s retribution for not killing all homosexuals, adulterers and owners of pet rabbits.” Then you all say, “Oh that darned Pat, acting out again, he just won’t go sit in the corner when we tell him to, tee hee!” The man is an asshole, tell it like it is! Criminy!) Well, I’m not going to tolerate people like that and I’m going to speak out against them, as you good Christians should do also, BUT YOU WON’T, at least not where anyone can see you do it. You need to make other people (especially the followers of these idiots) understand that you don’t approve of these people or their actions, but as I said, you won’t do it. And if you ever did do it, please reference the articles and interviews in the major news magazines, newspapers and television networks where you did it. Because it would be BIG news if you exposed them (but then again, you didn’t, did you?). I don’t see a need for tolerance at this point, but I see a need for shame, and I’m also ashamed for you.

I hope you see my (and ec’s) points. They are very easily understood, aren’t they? You’ve brought this upon yourselves because of your own (misplaced) tolerance. OUR tolerance has nothing to do with it. You don’t deserve that, at least not yet…

A quick search revealed a few links involving denunciations of those two—aside from tons of sites involving discussion boards and blogs and such where Christians were going after them (Google seems to be disproportionately fond of blogs and forums these days). Didn’t have time for much more.

http://www.abpnews.com/1754.article
http://www.sullivan-county.com/news/rel_war/fal…
http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/05…

Interesting that, with the first article, Christians have to take out an ad to get their point across—likely because the news services typically aren’t interested enough in covering Christian responses to them. Here mainline denominations responded because Falwell and Robertson had stepped over the line to try to speak for these denominations. This is a distancing from them because the mainline denominations recognize that these fellows are loonies who are pushing fanatical political agendas rather than focusing on the love of Christ.

It’s rather difficult to “expel those assholes from [our] religion” when Christians are so fragmented these days. Would have been much easier before we had ten thousand sects. In general, though, these high profile kooks tend to lead their own sects, which means the more serious and faithful denominations don’t much care about them because they know they’re wrong and they aren’t subject to such denominations, either to clear the air or take action against them.

OK, point taken, my dear. I suppose nobody, especially a single church or sect could afford to place advertisements in every major media source nationwide. That would be expecting a bit too much. The problem is that what is said by the idiots is taken up by the media and by the time anyone normal responds, it’s old news back on page 22. I understand. Free tolerance at the end of this sentence.

Love, Ken

We may have gone slightly off-topic here, sorry dex!

I should note that I do take your point, Koo, that it would be helpful in general for good Christians to raise a more prominent counter voice to the hateful or at least misleading screeching of the faux-Christian activists (I believe you would call them Dominionists).

kookookachoo wrote:
>Evil is evil and should not be tolerated by anyone!

There is a point if ever there was one. I agree completely. However I am either blissfully or painfully unaware of these people you speak of…

emptycalm wrote:

Then why do people like falwell and rush limbaugh or that other piece of shit ted haggart have so many followers and why do right voting christians vote in the most corrupt and inept leaders in the entire country? I’m sorry for getting the wrong impression of how christians think but what else am I supposed to go on? Everything I see everywhere is just negative. You are delusional if you think it’s just a small minority

Falwell= fucktard.
Robertson (dammit, EC, I GAVE you Robertson, and you didn’t even mention him)= fucktard.

Limbaugh? Not sure why he’s on your list, or why you’d be threatened by him, because he’s a wealthy buffoon with a damned good, marketable schtik.
But, yes, a fucktard. A bright, money- making fucktard, to be sure, but a fucktard nonetheless.

See? I’m a Christian, and I said it. Feel better?
No idea who Ted Haggart is, BTW.
Fucktard, I’m-a- thinkin?’

Ah…and why do the majority of Americans, or pretty much anybody in the world, follow mouthy fucktards?
Ask P.T. Barnum.
Better yet, ask me. Dave’s first rule: “People are stupid.”

Don’t follow Dave’s first rule. You’re better than that.

Wow.
Was my use of the term “fucktard” a little too offensive? Perhaps I should have used “shithead” or “asshat” instead, being of equivalent meaning, but less offensive?

Hello. HELLO. <tap- tap>Is this thing on? Anybody else out there?

There you go, Dave, making up new and beautiful cuss-words for all of us. We love ya, baby!

Is there anybody IN there, just nod if you can hear me…

Thanks and love, Ken

P.S. Fucktard seems an extremely apt description…

Hmmmmmm…... I seem to remember posting a reply to this sometime ago… apparently it did not save…